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Week 8 [02.12 – 08.12.2019] From movie to reality…



Probably each of us saw at least a fragment of a movie, which was based on the comic book. This is only fiction, which is supposed to entertain us. This fiction shouldn’t affect reality.No matter that’s a hero or a villain, Deadpool, Batman, Ironman, aliens or princess. We are happy when we are watching the movie (or not). We are talking about it with friends and we forget about it. Because it was just a movie. But have you ever wondered what would happen if some of these films moved to reality?

And what about Joker. Todd Phillips presents us a whole new picture of Joker. We don’t recognize him as a created character. Every change takes place before our eyes. It's not like Joker from ‘Dark Knight”. We don't see a psychopath with scars on his face. He don’t get pleasure from confusion, psychological games or just killing (at the beginning of course). The film begins in Gotham where there is a crisis. We meet Artur, who has problems and begins to kill in self-defense. Then it is caused by a desire to revenge. Growing tension in society and one bad comment from politician makes Joker a symbol of demonstration. How? The inhabitants put on clown masks like he, when he was killing at the first time.



https://www.antyradio.pl/Film/News/Protestujacy-na-calym-swiecie-przebieraja-sie-za-Jokera-36503



This image stayed in my head for a long time and then I was thinking that in the future it can happen. I wasn’t wrong. A week after I saw the movie, I found an article about it. In Chile, Lebanon, France, Iraq and most recently in Hong Kong …..are now anti-government demonstrations. All these places are connected with clown makeup and Joker masks. In film and reality, Joker has become a symbol of the social movement. Demonstrations are mainly about opposing the political system, corruption, elitism and threats to the democratic freedom. It doesn't look exactly like in the movie. There aren’t hundreds or thousands of people wearing masks. Now there are there the same people each day. But it may change. Maybe not today, not tomorrow. But this day may come when we see the picture like a frame from ‘Joker’.





https://dynaimage.cdn.cnn.com/cnn/c_fill,g_auto,w_1200,h_675,ar_16:9/https%3A%2F%2Fcdn.cnn.com%2Fcnnnext%2Fdam%2Fassets%2F191102204711-joker-protests-chile.jpg



Demonstrators in Hong Kong don’t give up and since the government prohibits wearing Joker masks they use Winnie the Pooh and Peppe Pig.



https://www.francetvinfo.fr/image/75nml8prh-07cf/1200/825/20280099.jpg



Here you are links to the websites where are short videos and photos from demonstrations.
https://www.huffingtonpost.fr/entry/au-liban-le-joker-est-devenu-une-figure-des-manifestations_fr_5dade3e1e4b08cfcc3204b11
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4SDvhaCvlA



Questions:
1. There are voices that say that the Joker provokes aggression and encourages violence, and there are also those who agree with WB's enlightenment that "one of the functions of telling stories is to provoke discussion of difficult and complicated topics." Do you agree or not? Which side are you on?
2. Did you know about this situation?
3. What is your opinion about the Joker mask in this situation?




Sources:
https://www.france24.com/en/20191024-from-beirut-to-hong-kong-the-face-of-the-joker-is-emerging-in-demonstrations
http://www.eskarock.pl/eska_rock_news/joker_staje_sie_symbolem_ludzie_na_calym_swiecie_zakladaja_maski_z_filmu_na_protesty/158294
https://www.antyradio.pl/Film/News/Protestujacy-na-calym-swiecie-przebieraja-sie-za-Jokera-36503

Comments

1. There are voices that say that the Joker provokes aggression and encourages violence, and there are also those who agree with WB's enlightenment that "one of the functions of telling stories is to provoke discussion of difficult and complicated topics." Do you agree or not? Which side are you on?
1.I agree with both statements and I don't choose sides as I see this movie as both - violence encourager and story provoker.
2. Did you know about this situation?
No I had no idea but in my opinion joker is more like a symbol here which can be describe bad as it represent chaos.
3. What is your opinion about the Joker mask in this situation?
I wouldnt ban it if you ask me and I dont mind it at all.
1. There are voices that say that the Joker provokes aggression and encourages violence, and there are also those who agree with WB's enlightenment that "one of the functions of telling stories is to provoke discussion of difficult and complicated topics." Do you agree or not? Which side are you on?
Those who think that the Joker character or movie provokes aggression are mainly people who want to fight it or are limited. There are a lot of movies and characters in which aggression manifests. This is not the reason. People are looking for a factor that will lead them to action, give them courage in the fight for their own. It was just Joker. Through his interesting and good-looking image. By accepting the crowd of the Joker himself. Personally, I think it's very good that it happened. People should not be afraid of the authorities in the fight for their rights.

2. Did you know about this situation?
Of course, this is a picture that can be seen very often in the media. I am very happy that thanks to this people want and try to change something in their country.

3. What is your opinion about the Joker mask in this situation?
This is a well-known and more interesting / good-looking icon. We've known her for years. However, each of us, regardless of the budget, can afford to look like a Joker, it's cool. We don't have to spend a lot of money on expensive and often poor quality costumes to play the role.
1. I believe that if someone is encouraged to violence by a movie, then he or she has some serious problems anyway. The movie is not a cause, but a trigger at best. I think that Joker is a movie which contrasts with the most comic-based movies as it actually makes you think after you watch it.

2. Yes, I was aware of that.

3. I think that it might become a symbol one day, like the V's mask from V for Vendetta became a symbol for Anonymous.
1. This is not WB's fault. Joker character is only a fictional movie character not real thing. Just because some group of already aggresive and violent people decides to use it as a role model it doesn't mean it provokes violence. Although I agree with the telling stories statement in question.
2. Yes, I heard some stories about it. It is just ridiculous.
3. As I said earlier: it is just justification for insane people
Anna Moskalenko said…
1. I agree with the WB’s explanation. There are millions of films showing violent behavior yet only Joker receives such strong criticism for that. If you want to know my opinion - I think that’s because of the Joker’s psychological problems. It’s almost year 2020, but people are still afraid to discuss or even think about it. People are afraid and ashamed to go to the psychologist or psychiatrist even when they realize that they need help. It IS the difficult and complicated topic that should be discussed.
2 and 3. I haven’t heard about people wearing Joker’s make up on protests but it’s not surprising. People should hide their face to protect their life and their family’s life. Why Joker? I think they’re doing this mostly because of the media’s fear of this character. Joker’s image is crazy, dangerous guy who won’t stop and maybe they want to show that they're not going to stop until they won.
Roman Dubovyi said…
1. Cinematography is an art. Art’s goal is to induce a reaction in someone’s mind. Negative emotions like aggression, disgust, hate etc. are also a reaction. So I don’t see how you can not support WBs’ statement.
People in Hong Kong could imply movie on their situation only because they already had the situation.

2. Nope, but I am not surprised.

3. For them it’s just another symbol of confrontation against system. Hiding your face is the main purpose of wearing the mask. What this mask resembles is not so important.
Olha Romaniuk said…
1. There are voices that say that the Joker provokes aggression and encourages violence, and there are also those who agree with WB's enlightenment that "one of the functions of telling stories is to provoke discussion of difficult and complicated topics." Do you agree or not? Which side are you on?
I definetly not agree with it. Not Joker provokes aggression, it's just some kind of catharsis. Some people have seen the way how you can express your emotions, your dissatisfaction. I think this is one of the main problems of modern society - the inability to express their emotions. We wear masks all the time, someone bigger, someone smaller. But aren't there a lot of people who are themselves, who don't pretend to be themselves? In some situations, pretending to be someone else requires an elementary courtesy, that's what scares you. The film simply shows a man who is tired of pretending.

2. Did you know about this situation?
I've heard of it, but I haven't gone into detail, so I'm sure I don't know everything.

3. What is your opinion about the Joker mask in this situation?
It's easier for a man to express emotions like that. It's hard to be yourself. But putting on a mask and being yourself "anonymous"... It is also possible that it creates an illusion of safety. At the rally, a person wearing a physical mask, and in the rest of his life - a mental mask.
Roman Batyuk said…
1. I agree with WB's enlightenment. It is just a movie. There were always thousands and thousands of content about violence and aggression. So if one film or video game makes you kill somebody or do something bad, you should definitely visit a psychiatrist. I think movies and video games should be interpreted as art. The problem of Joker is that the film tells us a very realistic story that could happen in real life. That is why people are wearing those masks. If the story was like in Avengers nobody would connect it with politics and the demonstrators would be other masks like Guy Fawkes or Joker from 'The Dark Knight'.
1. I definitely don’t agree with the statement that movies can provoke aggression. People who watch it should be aware that it’s part of the author’s concept and distinguish it from a real world. We encounter aggression every day and we should know how to deal with it.

2. Yes, recently it has been loud about it in the media. It’s good that people fight for their rights and despite of the bad reviews it’s good for the producer because it makes the movie more viral.


3. People are just looking for someone who is beyond the system and helps them to lead the protests. It seems to me that wearing a Joker mask can cause more problems because he is associated with a madman. The police might start thinking about protesters the same and I don’t think that’s what they mean.
1. I don't think that this movie provokes aggression or encourages violence. It's a stereotype simmilar to: "video games is the cause of kids violence". I do agree with WB's words. Movies are created to state topics, entertain us and force us to express their creation in our own way.

2. Yes, I've read the topic on antyradio site few days ago. This is not the first time it happens though.

3. It is a "sign" of someone who went totally insane because of one reason or another.

1. Intelligent people will be encouraged to talk and those less fortunate, who doesn't have much in their heads, could turn to violence. But you know, few hundreds of years ago we burned women on the piles and people was ok with it. We are a violent species and need to place these emotions somewhere. Some will find relief in sports, games, hunting or mugging people on the streets. It just depends on the person and his or her system of values and if he or she is easily influenced. To say that a movie cause violence, to me, is just looking for similarities when there are none.

2. & 3. Again, what situation? The fact that Hong Kong is fighting for its freedom? The fact that there is corruption in Chile and the government doesn't respect its civilians? The reason why people are wearing those masks is that they relate their situation with the pop culture movie that they saw and decide to make a theme out of it. There were a lot of situations like this before. Do you remember when people in Poland were wearing Guy Fawkes masks? They associated the mask with the movement against ACTA, a copyright treaty. It was caused by the situation in the country, not by the movie.
Iryna Lehusha said…
1. There are voices that say that the Joker provokes aggression and encourages violence, and there are also those who agree with WB's enlightenment that "one of the functions of telling stories is to provoke discussion of difficult and complicated topics." Do you agree or not? Which side are you on?
I think people are just looking for a reason for aggression. I like comics very much, especially the Joker character.
Movies are made for fun. There is a horror movie in which people are killed. But why doesn't anybody say that they cause aggression? My opinion - the main problem is such people.

2. Did you know about this situation?
No, I didn't know about this situation, and I would like don't know about it.
This situation shows the weakness of people who can't see the difference between a fictional character and real life. And people who can't control their emotions. 

3. What is your opinion about the Joker mask in this situation?
I can't say anything about that.
1. I think these voices who say that the Joker provokes aggression and encourages violence in my opinion didn't understand this movie. This movie is about that society can create monster if we will treat each other like that. It's easily to point inconvenient movie which touches this subject, that people are evil, not movies, games, books and so on. Guns/knives don't do crimes, people do.

2. Yes, I heard about this situation, I saw movie and I predict this situation.

3. I undestand why people put on them, they can feel injustice and anger. I think this movie is some kind of symbol which shows us how people feel living nowadays. I don't support or being against but I can understand.
Mateusz Szych said…
1. In my opinion, there should be a discussion on such topics. There are movies that are more aggressive. And the Joker raises important topics that we cannot ignore.

2. I often hear about these protests, this topic was also discussed on this blog.

3. In my opinion, the clown mask is a good choice, but in the case of Hong Kong the Winnie the Pooh mask is better because he is identified with the President of PRC.
Ivan Mazuryk said…
1. I do not agree with that. Joker is the the character of the fictional world. Thousands another characters exist and the healty mentally people understand that this is only it and nothing more. I can not imagine that bandid under judje says that he made the crime becouse he watched the movie before that.
2. No, I did not know about the situation and I think that this should not be shouted in media this way.
3. The opinion described in first answer. The healthy mentally people do not make the real things hiding behind the mast of character from movie.
dominik.samsel said…
1. There are voices that say that the Joker provokes aggression and encourages violence, and there are also those who agree with WB's enlightenment that "one of the functions of telling stories is to provoke discussion of difficult and complicated topics." Do you agree or not? Which side are you on?
2. Did you know about this situation?
3. What is your opinion about the Joker mask in this situation?

1. Let's start this answer by reminding that Joker is a movie, great piece of movie by the way, recommended for adults only. So it's directed to people with own minds and thinking. It should be only treated as an art, it shouldn't be associated with any political, provocative, anarchist statements.
It's not the first time when main character on silver screen is a psycho, man with mental issues who's doing something really bad, so I don't understand why this time we should throw away all our goods and act like Arthur Fleck in a movie. Having said that, in my opinion we should disconnect every movement involved in this and admire Todd Phillips' and Joaquin Phoenix's masterpiece.

2. I was aware that some people used image of Joker in Hong Kong and as soon as I left theatre it was quite clear for me that there might be an attempt to do so.

3. Right now it's not only a plastic mask. It's kind of symbol of rebellion, revolt. In the past the same case was with Salvador Dali mask ("La casa de Papel") and The Annonymous mask. Unfortunately movies are influential to people and they can easily be infected with that kind of thinking.
Marta Matysik said…

I agree with you, Joker is not typical based on comic movie.

I haven't seen this movie, so I have no comparison.
Marta Matysik said…
I've know him from years too, but this time for me he is different. It no exactly the same character like in the Dark Knight.
And I agree with you, the simplicity of his costume is definitely he's advantage.
Marta Matysik said…
Before like in the Dark Knight, I agree, Joker liked chaos, but now? Maybe, but it wasn't right away.
Marta Matysik said…
Okey, thank you for your comment.
Marta Matysik said…
This is taboo and this will not change quickly. Unfortunately. ButI was focused on repeating a fragment of the film and not on people's fear of the Joker character. You might be right. Really thank you.
1. I agree with both statements. On the one hand, those who claim that the character of the jocker is negatively marked, evoke evil and fear are right. However, this character has a deeper problem. Joker clearly has psychological problems but he can't deal with it and he chooses the terrifying path he is following. Personally, I don't perceive this character negatively. I think that this character does not encourage violence and evil but causes reflection on life and the fact that if we have a problem, we must ask for help, because the consequences of being in such a state may be irreversible.

2. Yes, I heard about such situations. A few weeks ago, even here on the course the topic of protests in Hong Kong was discussed.

3. I think that the Joker's mask used by the protesters symbolizes that they are ready for everything, that they do not go back and use all means to ensure that their demands are met.
Marta Matysik said…

I don't think I will agree with you. Okey you are wearing the mask because you want to safe your face and life, but in Hong Kong they are wearing the symbol which are banned in their country. So it seems to me that this is not accidental.
Marta Matysik said…
Okey, thank you for your comment.
Marta Matysik said…
There is a lot of sources. And it's difficult to find all information. Some websites cite each other and not all facts are the same on them.
Marta Matysik said…
In this movie was one more think. This film shows that normal people can fight with politicians, for kind of justice.
Marta Matysik said…
That's true but other mask also aren't accidental

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