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Week 4 (26.10 - 01.11) (Too) late motherhood

     


      Many years ago women gave birth to children when they were  about 18-23 years old. Then it was normal. Women didn’t work on a regular basis, didn’t educate so their main objective was to  take care of home, give birth and raise children.

     Then a few woman changed the world  and now everything looks different.

     The majority of us can educate, develop and engage in professional development. When we are 18- we take A-level exams. When we are 23  we are in the process of studying at a university. When we are 24-25 we start our first serious  job. Over the years we work hard, we gain new experiences. When we are 30 years old we start to  think about starting a family but we don’t think about children. Oh no- it is too early- we think. We must take care of our career. And when we are  between 35 and 40 we decide to have a child. It is (too)late motherhood. What do you think about it?

      Everything is fine if our child is born healthy and strong. But what if our child is born sick?

      There is a high probability to give birth to a child with Down’s syndrome or another disease . In Poland statistics look quite good.  Polish women still decide to have their  first child before 30. It looks much  worse in USA and United Kingdom.

Advantages of late motherhood:

For a child:

-          Better psychosocial development;
-          Better  living conditions;
-          Parents spend more time with their child.

For a mother:

-          Possibility to choose an optimal time for motherhood;
-          Better child raising conditions;
-          Financial independence.

Disadvantages of  late motherhood:

For a child:

-          Worse health conditions after birth;
-          Possibility of genetic defects;
-          Worse contact with older parents;
-          Lack or weak contact with grandparents;
-          Lack of siblings;
-          Parents are less patient.

For a mother:

-          Postpartum period complications;
-          Orphaned children;
-          sharing time between a child and old parents.



Source:

Zuchora Anita. Nowe, dojrzałe matki, Zwierciadło 2013, nr 10, s.113-118.

Comments

Since I am a man it looks different from my perspective. But looking from a women perspective I understand clearly why they are not in a rush. In my opinion it is certainly well that woman are not only mothers and housekeepers nowadays, they finally start getting education and work on their’s professional careers. All of that causes that having children is not a priority.

My mother was around 30 years old when I was born and among my friends the situation seems to be similar. I guess that now point of view of woman is similar to man’s point of view. We want firstly feel financially secure, have a permanent job, bought a house, be prepared and wait for a while before we will decide about having family.
My mother has given birth to me exactly on her 20th birthday.

When I was a child, I was really happy I had such a young mom. I was proud of it. I remember I dreamt of having child at such a young age, so that my children would be proud of me as well.

But now, my perspective has dramatically changed. I can't imagine having a baby in my age, and I would be totally horrified if I got pregnant at the age of 19. I know it's not the end of the world and that people somehow manage in a situation like that (well, my parents did :)), but for me, having a child is not a priority and, to be honest, I don't know if it ever will be. I would hate not being able to develop my education, career, or passions in the full extent... I have many wishes and dreams, and having a child is not one of them.

Speaking about late motherhood, have you seen this campaign released a few months ago? I think it was a really unsuccessful one on so many levels. Not only did they choose a young actress, but also suggested that women don't want to have kids due to travels and expensive caprices. What do you think about that?
Unknown said…
I don't know much about pregnancy and all the health consequences 'cause I've never really been interested in having a baby, but I think that nowadays medicine is developed enough to prevent most of the complications resulting from that late motherhood.

I'd like to refer to some points you've made
1) Worse health conditions after birth
I'm no expert, but from what I've heard such thing may occure if the mother is perhaps about 45 years old. Yes, the risk does rise with age but pregnancy before 40 is rather fine.
2) Worse contact with older parents
This one doesn't make sense to me to be honest. Parents aren't supposed to be their children buddies plus come on, it's not like if the mother is older she's going to just leave the child to themself of what? Additionally you kind of contradict yourself stating "parents spend more time with their child" as an advantage
3) Lack or weak contact with grandparents
Sorry but grandparents would have to actually be dead. Grandparents are always the ones to be the ones to spoil their grandchild and love them more than their child. It doesn't matter if they're 50 or 70.
4) Lack of siblings
How is that even relevant? I'm an only child. My mother was 27 when I was born. I don't think it's a bad thing.
5) Parents are less patient
I'd say it's the other way round actually.

I don't think I have anything to disagree with when it comes to advantages.

Hah, also person above wrote about that infamous campain about motherhood - it made me really mad, trying to guilt trip me, just leave everything and have a child now, because it's more important that your education and wanting to fulfill your dreams. I am my own person and I don't want to sacrifice the things I've planned to achieve in order to have a child, I'm not ready to commit myself to motherhood. And I don't know if I'll ever be.

Anyway what I think matters the most is being mentally prepared for the child. Secondly being prepared financially. If a woman knows she can handle it at 20 years old, then ok. If she's not prepared until 40 then don't force it.
Unknown said…
I think people should be able to decide for themselves. I know both young and "old" parents. My mother's sister gave birth to her first child when she was 40 (which was 4 years ago). The girl is healthy, they are very happy and my aunt and her boyfriend are very good, aware parents. In my opinion it's better to wait than to make a child just for the sake of making it because" I'm young and I just can't wait any longer". My sister is 29 and she haven't even started to think about getting pregnant. I think that parenthood isn't easy and it should be a conscious decision. Most young parents I know didn't make a choice to become parents and only time will tell if they will regret that they weren't more careful in the future.

I know that there is a greater chance of the child being sick if you give birth around 40 but fortunately now a days there are tests that can predict down's syndrome and I don't think anyone having a child in their 40-ties wouldn't take a test like that.

I personally don't plan on having children of my own because of various reasons (same as Patrycja it just isn't a dream of mine) but I think people should be able to decide for themselves without social pressure. Having children doesn't stop you from fulfilling your dreams but it certainly can make it harder, so we should decide for ourselves what our priorities in life are and if we want to pursue both passions and children or only one in full extent. As I mentioned before I believe that parenthood should be a conscious choice because you can't just "stop" being a parent, you take responsibility for the life you create. So I think it's certainly a safer option to wait longer if you are just not sure what you want in life or do you even want to become a parent at all than just jump into parenthood because society says it's "the time" and it's supposedly the right thing to do.

I knew someone would mention the recent "pro-motherhood" campaign :) I also wonder what people here think about it?
Unknown said…
Thanks for your comment. I understand your opinion and you're right. Apparently we have hard time and It isn't sufficient when only man works.
Unknown said…
Thanks you for showing your point of view.
Oh no, I agree with you. I can't imagine that I have a child now or when I was 20 years old like your mother. In my opinion it is too early. Although my mother given birth to my sister when she was 22.
I also have many dreams but one of them is having a family and children.
I don't think that I will have to resign of something and I don't think that having a family and children will be huge recantation for me.
Of course everyone has a right to have his own opinion on this subject.
Campaign which you evoke is not good. It doesn't encourage to having a baby in no way.
I think that some women renounce to be a mother because they are selfish and they love comfort. Of course- not all women.
I don't think it can be called selfishness. You can be selfish if you already have a child and refuse to take care of them because of your own needs. But if you want comfort in life and therefore choose not to have children, I don't think it's selfish at all. Even better - if you know you wouldn't be able to take enough care for children and therefore not have them, I think it's a good and logical approach.

To put it in other words - there is no such thing as selfishness if you are alone. This trait only exists if there is another person around you and you choose your needs over his or hers needs. But if you don't have children, you can't say you're selfish because you simply have noone to be selfish to.

It's similar to having pets. Some people don't want to have a pet because they don't want such a responsibility. Would you call them selfish? I would call them reasonable.
Unknown said…
I wanted to write the same thing. As usual I totally agree with Patrycja ;)
Unknown said…
I agree with your opinion. Everyone matures in his time and it is not a certain age for each person. If a person feels the need at first to Educate himsefl and later create a family then nobody should prevented from doing this or, at worse harass this person. If a woman is afraid to have a baby after 35 she can always adopt a child from an orphanage.
In my humble opinion it mainly depends on a mother at what age she decides to have a child. Some women prefer to develop their career for a longer period than previous generations used to do so it should be totally up to one's decision. Of course there is growing probability of giving birth to dysfunctional child the higher age of mother is but age is not the only factor of some illnesses or genetic abnormalities.
We should write collective comments for the both of us :D
Unknown said…
Haha, that could actually work ;)

Furthermore in my opinion it's selfish to have a child only because you want someone to take care of you when you are old (proverbial glass of water) or it's selfish when people push their kids into parenthood just because they must have grandchildren.
Unknown said…
I think this is very tough subject and I am happy that we can duscuss it. As you mentioned, women role has changed. Nowadays we want to finish studies, get a job, we care about our career and we want to be independent. I think lack of independency is really awful - I have read some articles about women that have no choice to finish their relationship (I mean unsuccesful marriages), because they have no experience nor knowledge, and they are unable to start any job! And that's sick. But on the other hand - the best time for our bodies to give a birth is to be 18-24 years old. Soo... We need to choose. And that choice is almost impossible! I have friends that already have a child, but as I talked with them, it came out that they were totally not ready for it and it has changed all their plans. And now - imagine you have a child, you are studying and you have a job (because you must have money to live). How much time do you spend with a child? I guess almost none. And that's another tragedy. I am really pround of my good friend who is managing it, but on the other hand I know that she is not doing things she really want as good as she could. Sometimes she wasn't prepare for an exam, sometimes she had to stay with her daughter instead coming for an exam she was already prepared, and so on... And she must have sacrificed many things for another. It is extremely hard to do, because she really can't abandon any of these...
Unknown said…
You said that it is out free choice, and of course it is, but I think it is not about to force people to do that. It is rather to show that it could be too late if we wait any longer. But on the other hand - sure, we need to be ready for it.
Unknown said…
Late motherhood is very popular nowadays and all you guys wrote different reasons in your comments and I agree with all of them. But I think that every woman should clearly understand that if one woman has given birth to a baby at the age of 40+ it doesn't mean that she will be able to do it. And it depends on many reasons, such as:

- Ovarian reserve; Women are born with all of the oocytes (eggs) that they will ever have; they do not produce more oocytes. Although there are approximately six to eight million eggs at birth, many of these are lost during childhood so that by the time a female begins her periods she only has about 300,000 to 500,000 eggs left. During the typical menstrual cycle 10-30 eggs are recruited for growth on a daily basis, but only one of these dominates to become a mature follicle ready for fertilization on a natural cycle. The rest die off resulting in the loss of hundreds of eggs per year.

So if you are going to have a first baby at the age of 35+, it will be good for you to pass some medical tests about ovarian reserve.

- Health; I think it is clearly understandable and every one should have an active lifestyle and just be healthy.

- And so on.

What about Down's syndrome, I know that now there are two medical tests that can give you a 99.9% result. So I think a late pregnancy and not only the late one should be well planned by the couple and then everything will be ok :)
Unknown said…
Although I'm a man, I can totally understand the women's decision concerning late motherhood. Nowadays, everyone wants to be independent. It's not only the men's duty to provide the financial stability for a family, but women's either. It is a hard decision to postpone or even give up on such important part of human's life - being a parent. I consider it as a really reasonable idea - to reproduce no sooner than we can affor it. It is a duty of a parent to provide his/her children the vital factors such as good education, favorable conditions for self-development etc. The love isn't enough.

Moreover, I think that it is better to wait and get pregnant when both of parents feel ready. Even when it means that they'll never have their own children. There is enough of abandoned children in orphanages that are dreaming about parental love. Still, there are also people that shouldn't have children at all, but they force themselves because they think that it is the way it should look like. I'm really happy that nowadays the awareness of the duties of being a parent is increasing and people decide more consiously.
Unknown said…
Today's society and economic situation shape our decisions and goals.
Our ambition, the desire to have and to improve the quality of life are increasingly being placed in the first place. Hence the decision to increasingly overlap in later pregnancies.

But described factors only affect people who before deciding on upbringing of the child, they want to ensure appropriate conditions earlier.
Families who do not attach importance to it, they have no problem with it and women become pregnant, almost a year after year, regardless of age. The vast majority have no prospect of a better life, and often count on state aid in the upbringing of children.
Unknown said…
I think late motherhood is not good for creating a healthy society because of a risk of genetic disorders. But I’m far from stigmatizing women who decide to have a baby in their thirties. For me, the most important thing in motherhood is when woman got pregnant intentionally.
Unknown said…
My mother has given birth to my brother when she was 23 years old. I was born when she was 32 years old and I had 10 points in Apgar score. Actually, I'm 23 years old too and I'm young, healthy woman with long and multifarious perspective to the future, to be honest I can't imagine me as a mother now. But if I had a baby in this time of my life I would cope with this situation. Motherhood for me is one of the most beautiful achievements in woman life therefore it would be rather extra bonus for me and I would try to integrate this into my daily activities. Late motherhood is caused because of feeling a greater sense of self-realization and science by women and according to me this is postivie effect of contemporary times. I want to self-realizate, develop my interest and educate. Motherhood should not be seen as a renunciation of hobby, work or education. Patrycja mentioned about not good campain about late motherhood. It showed problem like: motherhood or your life. I think that everything can be reconciled with little effort. On the other side, we should remember that some women decide to have a baby in late term because they are not ready to motherhood. It's better than the sight of young mother who herself is a emotional child.
Unknown said…
I have nothing against late motherhood. Of course if our body didn't cope with pregnancy then better option is adoption. I think that the health of the child doesn't depend on the age of women, beacuse forties may have a better body condition than twenties who doesn't care about her health. Women who want to make a career, they should have the right to motherhood. In my opinion nowadays 30 years old is the best age for have a child; you are not too old and probably you have good work and some life balance.
Unknown said…
With motherhood comes great responsibility and the sense of responsibility is developed mainly throughout Life experience. The older mother-to-be is the better conditions for the child’s mental upbringing can be provided. The only limitation is the fact that with the passing of time, after women 35s, the risk of child’s health damage rapidly increases. For me the solution is quite simple, the optimal age of mother should be between 27 – 30 years old.

On the other hand, as we all know children are the result of love and love cannot be controlled : ) Let alone the fact that Poland got negative birthrate and we as the (still) young generation should do something about it.
Unknown said…
It seems all that was relevant to this subject has been already said. Well, just to add my opinion, motherhood is an enormous responsibility and I believe that if a woman does not feel ready for it, she shouldn't be forced in any way. I have nothing against late motherhood. It's better not to have a child at all rather than have it and regret the decision later, because this is something you obviously can't turn around and start anew.

Also, Patrycja posted a link to campaign video. I watched it and I admit I have similar feelings to what Aleksandra Grigorian wrote. The campaign literally wants to guilt trip me and it is something that makes me angry. Parenthood or everything else, like there is no other option.
Unknown said…
Yes I am a man, and my opinion is worthless for many woman. But what i want to say is that, we live in civilized country where we are free. So do what you like. It's your body and your choice. If you are 18 or 50, it doesn't matter. You are a free person and can give birth whenever you like. But if you are young and you are still not sure if you are ready but you are already pregnant then you should find some help. There are many people and institutions witch will do their best to support you and your family.
Unknown said…
I think that motherhood between 35 and 40 is too late. nowadays the most important are money and career. It is important but doesn’t give us real happienes, family does. The young women don’t want to be mothers. They want to feel comfortable, have fun. This picture of woman shows us the media. Image of successful woman that has a lot of money, career, and comfortable life, because she doesn’t have house duties. She wants to have fun and not wonder what will be in a few years. It is terrible but I hope that women will feel the need to become a mother much earlier than between 35 and 40 years old, when the baby's health is at risk.
Unknown said…
This is subject for longer considerations.
btw collective comments are great idea :D
Unknown said…
Thanks for your extensive comment. On certain issues I agree with you.
I'm glad that this topic provoked you to extensive conversation.
I felt that problem of motherhood may be good a starting point for discussion.
Unknown said…
Of course people should be able to decide for themselves. I hate when other try decide for us. This is not rule when older woman gives a birth child must be ill. Generalization is not good idea in this subject.
I have never before heard about test which you quote, but I checked it and it is true. I'm afraid that is not accurate, but of course I haven't got knowledge this type.
Unknown said…
Natalia I love your objectivism.
Unknown said…
Thanks for your participate in the discussion.
Unknown said…
You say many years ago woman gave birth to children when they were about 18-23 years old. I'd say that it is not uncommon this days. By no way I'm saying it's typical but it happens and quite often is planned. I personally know a couple who get married and have their first child before they hit 24. And it wasn't a shotgun wedding.
Unknown said…
You're completely right.
Of course being mother is very responsible function. You are a mother all day and all night. You always think about your baby. Does it have everything what he need, does it healthy, does it feel good and so on. In my opinion is very hard but also very beautiful. My sister has a son and she is pregnant now. She was afraid and now she is afraid, but she is also happy and she wouldn't change it for nothing else. Of course she has a good and bad time, but she love her son and her life.
The other reason that you didn't mention is that women used to marry much older men (working, already with some savings) and their only life goal was to give birth to children - the more the better - so it would be good to start young. The other thing is that nowadays people are less mature emotionally compared to a hundred years ago and are less willing to start a family before travelling and fulfilling their life dreams.
I am scared by all the genetic defects that a child may develop if conceived by older parents. The natural system of rejecting defective embryos doesn't work that well when a woman reaches certain age and it may be really dangerous both for mother and child. I am freaked out only looking at numbers - there is a 1:5000 to have this, 1:200 to have that and 1:300 to have that - when all these are added there is practically no chance of having a healthy child!
In my opinion if people want to have better chances of having a healthy child it is advisable to start a family earlier. There surely are ways to have a child and pursue a fulfilling and satisfying career.
Unknown said…
Wow, from where is your knowledge in this subject? Your statement is impressive. Thanks for it and also thanks for your calm and objective answer for the article.
Unknown said…
Thanks for your comment. Good to see the man's poin of view in this subject.
Your opinion is reasonable and empathic.
You're talking about adoption. Would you take child this type?
Unknown said…
Good point. You don't tolerant setback?
Unknown said…
I'm glad for your comment because I finally agree with someone completely. Thanks for your comment. You gave me the faith in people :D
Unknown said…
Good point :D I like you and You're right. We as the young generation should do something about it. Are you planning something? ;)
Unknown said…
I think that having a child it is a big problem, It changes life pemanetely. You have to spend a lot of time, you have to give up on many things you were used to and of course have enough money to ensure its future, education etc.
In my opinion, women should not hurry with the decision of having a baby. They should finish school, make their dreams come true and develop their careers first. I think the time will come when they feel that they want to devote to the child.
It must be remembered that children need parents and not parents who are grandparents.
Unknown said…
Thanks for your opinion. As regards a campaign we all agree.
Unknown said…
You're right. I think that women use institutional help too rarely in Poland.
Unknown said…
I'm glad when I read opinion like your. Good to know that young women think like you :D Thanks.
Unknown said…
Great to know it. I'm really happy when I see two young people who get married from love and not from child, because then we talk about shotgun wedding.
Unknown said…
Thank you for your comment.
Unknown said…
Thank you for your partcipation in our discussion.
Unknown said…
I totally agree with your last sentence. Thank you for your comment.
On the one hand it is very important that women should have the first child before 30. At the same time we have to remember that many people don’t have financial security and prioritise the jobs, because this is were they make the money. The trend is that the women have children later on in their lives even at the ages of 40. Society must find compromise between financial security and family life like in the Scandinavian countries in Europe. Only wealthy society are able to finance future generation. Otherwise more immigrants are adopted to society like in Germany - quite different point of view.
Unknown said…
It's hard to say it now, but if it wasn't possible to have my own children, probably I would consider that.
Julia Osiak said…
Late motherhood nowadays is the effect of the change in our lifestyles. Not only women pursue their careers and want a life to be just about them for some time. Men are also not so eager to settle down and have a family in their early twenties. I think that its everyone's own decision. Each person will be ready for a child at a different age, at a different point in their life. Both cases, the young and the older parent, have their pluses and minuses, just as you pointed out, but the only correct answer to when one should think about having a family, is when he or she really is ready for this commitment.
Unknown said…
I think that its caused by the livestyle: In the past man's responsibilities was to work and bring money, provide safety and womens were staying home with kids, rising them etc. But now womens wants to have their own carriers, be more independent so they simply does not have time for kids. Is it ok? Not me to judge, its up to the parents.
Michal Kulesza said…
There are some examples of too late motherhood even in Poland - have you heard about case of old actress that expected higher support from government for having babies at her 60ties?

It's really dangerous for the society and it may be bad also for children, Kids do compare their parents sometimes so one might feel really bad when told that his mother could be mother of his friends mothers.

Also higher possibility of genetic defects is rather dangerous. Don't you think that it should be prohibited by law to get pregnant at certain age? It's not a good idea but may be a way to stop people like this polish actress.

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