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Week 10 (8-14.12.14) Bang, Bang




Do you know that photo ? There is even an opinion that it is the most famous war photograph. I didn’t even know that the word “famous” can be used to describe that kind of photography. The author of this picture is Kevin Carter, a member of (again) famous photo group “Bang Bang Club”.

Bang Bang Club is a label that 4 photographers used to describe themselves. Kevin Carter, Greg Marinovich, Ken Oosterbroek, and João Silva worked in the early 90s in RPA during the transformation period and the fall of apartheid. They showed the world how a war in South Africa looked like. The photo I’ve mentioned in the beginning is the most recognizable from their works. It was shot by Kevin Carter and is said to be the reason for Carter’s suicide. The fact is that despite their big success, worldwide fame and journalist prizes, they had to face serious mental problems due to everything they experienced.

Carter photographed a starving girl with a companion of a vulture. Public opinion accused him that he was taking a photo instead of helping the child. Carter admitted that he waited 20 minutes hoping that the vulture would spread its wings. After publication in New York Times that photo became an icon of “Africa’s despair”. The editorial office got thousands of phone calls whether the child survived or not. After NYT published that frame as a cover photo, some serious volunteer initiative started to grow to help people in places at war. In the end he somehow contributed to grow awareness of war among people. He was awarded with the Pulitzer Prize - one of the most important ones. He also paid the highest price for his job because his mental problems drove him to a suicide.

That whole situation can be a good point to start a discussion about photojournalism, and the morality of journalism, especially of those involved in war cases. There is something worrying in a photographer’s behavior when he is waiting for a good shot in front of a dying child and a vulture, don’t you think so ? I have mixed feelings because I’m not sure whether the photographer wanted to show the world the current situation of starving kids in Sudan or he wanted to have a good photo to fulfill his ambition.

You can read about Kevin and his colleagues in the book: “Bractwo Bang Bang”. It’s written by Greg Marinovich and João Silva, two members of the club. It consists of actual memories and thoughts from RPA from days of war. It’s about male friendship and superhuman courage, and of course about a race for the best photo. It can partially answer some questions you may want to ask. Like, what were they thinking ? Did they have problems with drugs? Did they feel fear ?





Questions:
1. What is your opinion on morality of war photographers ?
2. Can journalists make change with photos and books?

Sources:http://lubimyczytac.pl/ksiazka/126099/bractwo-bang-bang
http://iconicphotos.wordpress.com/2009/08/12/vulture-stalking-a-child/

Comments

Unknown said…
I have to admit, I have never thought about war photographers before. I think that their job is very dangerous. They put at risk their own life to take a good picture. It is something worth admiration. However, as you said there is something disturbing when you think that a photographer prefers to work than to help people who are hurt or injured. Personally, I cannot imagine myself in a situation like this. I can understand that for war photographers taking a shocking and truthful image it is very important because it is his / her salary. But I think that sometimes money is less important than human life, and I guess war photographers sometimes forget about it.
Unknown said…
Yes.. making dying people photos for salary sound creepy...
Unknown said…
To me I always thought it's not ethical, since instead of helping on the spot, they just takes pictures.

I think the only thing they can change something, is by making people informed.
Unknown said…
I agree, because without their works, people wouldn't know what's really going on in south africa...
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Unknown said…
Have you heard about one photographer, who took a photo of man being run by a subway? The photo ended up on the cover of a magazine with a title "This man will die in a minute". Amd the discussion started. Was it good that he took that photo or should he have helped the man instead? What do you think Tomek?
Unknown said…
I have heard about photographers war, but only few informations so it was nice to read the text. When I see such photos it makes me sad that photographers take adavntages of thos less fortunate not only to make a living but also to have their 'war' and to gain prestige and win prizes. But on the other hand it is their job to take pictures, show reality. So I think if they can do their job not forgetting about humanity it can be ok....
Unknown said…
I agree that those photographer, who take advantage of other people are awful. But what do you think about people who buy those photos and admire them? Can a picture like this one above can be considered beautiful? It's realy hard and complex I think...
Unknown said…
I've heard about a famous case of a staged photo that shown a boy sleeping between his parents graves. First people were fascinated by it and then when it came to light that it wasn't real everyone became outraged.

http://www.imediaethics.org/News/4346/Hoax__photo_of_syrian_boy_sleeping_between_parents_graves_was_staged.php
Unknown said…
This comment has been removed by the author.
Unknown said…
I could somehow explain to myself motives that drove Kevin Carter to make this
photo. As you wrote, this photo probably saved a thousand of children like this
one, by showing the world how bad is current situation in Africa.
The more shocking thing to me, are sitauations like this one :
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-glFOIui0ejQ/UFeAEGjbxlI/AAAAAAAAIvI/h_0GL2NKd7U/s1600/cherisma2.jpg
where photographers are almost fighting to take a best shot, having no respect to
dead girl. This are no longer a photographers that try to change something, but
just looking for some sensation that will sell.
Rafał Banach said…
This comment has been removed by the author.
Rafał Banach said…
Honestly for me, taking such images has a very raising role in our society. People often are not aware of what is really happening in the world and bringing them such extremes on pictures are very important to make them more self-conscious.

Yeah, this may change something. Maybe not now but in the future for sure. This is an great example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aEyR0rl5xQ&hd=1. Before that I don't even realize how it looks for Syrian people.
PrzemekM said…
I think war photographer is not easy job. They make money on impressive photos from war zone, but they chose to do this for some reason, the dont make money on typical wedding photos
The leave home for a long time to make maybe one great photo, in my opinion they show as how world really look like, and this impress me
For sure journalist can make change with their job.
If we talk about war photographers i would like to recommend you great movie about them.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6pPxqWe7j1U
1. What is your opinion on morality of war photographers ?
I think they are honest on contrary to some wild life phographers. Somebody has to do this job.

2. Can journalists make change with photos and books?

Of course yes, pictures are more straightforward than 100 words. It is easier to shock by picture than by text.
Unknown said…
1. What is your opinion on morality of war photographers ?
The job of war journalists / photographers is important as their are the ones who portray the war, show the reality of conflicts (or at least they should). I think it's hard to judge ethical aspects of their actions from our sitting-comfortable-and-safe-in-home point of view.
2. Can journalists make change with photos and books?
Yes, they can raise awerness of conflicts among people.
Unknown said…
Until those journalists and photographers are not acting in to favor of one of the sides, I think their job is important and dangerous, they should show the war in the way it really looks like with all its blood, dirt and death. It could seem violent, but how people will understand that it is not just another 'Call of Duty' game and not only soldiers are dying on the battlefield but also children and women.
In my opinion one photo could be the thing that will make people to think.
Michal Kulesza said…
I don't know how war photography differs from sharing photos of people wounded or killed in car accidents. Moreover, there are such situations that photographers are more into taking photos than helping these people.

I always couldn't understand why TV helicopter flying around flooded terrains is only sending information where are people on the roofs and not helping them. They admitted that they have no trained people on board... Well... Couldn't they just allow services to use their heli?
Making such terrifying photographs to improve awareness is fine by me. Actually I would even encourage it, since it is important to be aware of such horrors. However it is obviously not right to do these things only for profit and shock – effect. Also I believe that there shouldn't be need for altering such photographs – they should carry the message by themselves.
Unknown said…
Yes I know this photo as a lot of more similar to this one, showed drastic, terrible situations on whole the World.

War photographer is a job, as others one. Connection with risk, effort and skill. Is sad that they are taking photos of poor people, instead giving them food or water, but that is not their responsibilities. Thanks to them we (although some) know how war looks like and can imagine how terrible it is.

In my opinion that good way to show people how terrible life could be, by photos or books. Then we can think about it and appreciate what we have. But what could we do to change it? This is not our decisions what happens there.
Unknown said…
Can you add source about this situation? I didn't heard about it. Im definitely agree that photographer should firstly help him, but... how did victim look after run by subway?
Unknown said…
In my opinion the Polish police have there good and bad sides. Ofcourse there are moments when the police get a bit to aggressive thats when the media make it loud about them. The police might have just a bit too many rights but after all if the police wouldnt be here the world would have been a much more dangerous place to live in.
Unknown said…
I would not judge the journalist, he is doing his job. Those photos are precious to us, because we can see the cruelty of war. Otherwise we would have only stories about it. The other thing is if he could actually help people he was photographing. And I think that he could not. During war we change our thinking. We have to considerate what is the most important for us and how to not get harmed. The journalist decided and he took the responsibility, we should not judge him for what he has done.
Unknown said…
I have never heard about bang bang. Their morality of journey depends on their really behavior in relation to war victims. I think that their photography shows people from other than Africa countries real disaster inhabitants of Africa. I wonder if the photos are not made only for commercial purposes. Mass culture likes violence, shocking news. It enchains people attention and sells like hot cakes. Bang bang photographers can have with these works a lot of money. Generally in my opinion their work is dangerous, they take a risk. Work in constant stress requires a strong character and courage.
Unknown said…
I don't understand people who say that photojournalists are like vultures themselves. There are people who are assigned to help the suffering ones in the most obvious way - like helping them to dress, feeding them or teaching them - and then there are others who are assigned to spread the information worldwide. They have the ability to create powerful shots that touch andd move thousands or millions of people around the world. In my opinion it is as helpful as feeding the people. I think that a photo of a journalist feeding the child would give the impression that the child is taken care of. The photo with the vulture is so powerful that it triggered some volunteer initiatives. Maybe there are some photographers without feelings, who are waiting for the perfect shot just from ambition reasons, however we should not forget that they are all people with feelings and they are trained to control them "for the greater good".
Unknown said…
I think that photos like these can put our lives in a whole different perspective. I have a big framed photo of an African girl on my wall and looking at it makes me grateful for what I have and it reminds me that there are people that need help somewhere outside my cozy house.
Unknown said…
Helping on the spot is not the only way and people help in all the ways they can. Using you education to do this is good, because maybe you're the only photographer who is not afraid of going someplace dangerous. Some drive and deliver food, some inform about contraceptive methods or health stuff and some inform the rest of the world what's going on.
I partially agree with what you have written. However, I think that the most important thing here are the motives behind photographers actions. They might just did for fame or they wanted to shock people in order to make them more aware of situation in Africa.
Mateusz Frycie said…
I agree that work of war journalists is extremely important, but, on the other hand, it's also a very dangerous and morally challenging task. The photos that they are taking are often full of violence and brutality and one is often wondering why they didn't help the person in the picture, what they were thinking, why they were so indifferent. One has to be very careful when judging them. Maybe, they did not help that particular child or woman in the photo, but by showing it to a wider publicity they made a difference. They showed things that people were afraid to tell the world about. They made others aware of the problems that no one dared to tackle before. It is possible that they couldn't change the fate of one person, but they definitely help thousands of people everyday be simply presenting their work.
Unknown said…
Thats true... but here we are talking about guy who is sitting in front of vulture and dying child waiting for moment he wants to see... something wrong here....
Unknown said…
In this sittuation, he couldn't help him, i guess. But why he made this photo ? By accident, or on purpouse.... I don't like when people hunts for sensation...
Unknown said…
Good point. Read the book, to find out if they could remember about humanity, and If they could stay psycho-healthy
Unknown said…
Fascinating, is wrong word in case of that kind of photogrpahy
Unknown said…
That's sad truth... many things have changed since Bang,Bang club worked...
MartaSB said…
To make a good war-related photo someone has to actually go there and survive. I believe that it can help other people see how the situation looks like, but it has its disadvantages. There is just one more civilian who can get hurt...
rf. said…
Looking at that photo it struck me as if the photographer was the vulture, his photo the prey. I don't think that the photographer did anything wrong though. He decided to risk his life going after a war photo shoot, and in the end he paid the ultimate price, where the conscience happened the act as a bullet.
Unknown said…
I don't think it's bad what those photojournalist do. People who did nothing more than these photographers to help, shouldn't have right to judge them. And as long they don't alter or direct scenes in their photos, they are making good job by showing how world actually looks in different places. But when photojournalist manipulate the scene to get more dramatic shot which doesn't show the truth, in order to get more money or because of political reason etc., then they are just the worst scumbags.
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Asia said…
It's hard to judge such things as photographers want just to
make us realize how cruel wars are, but on the other hand I feel
that the fighters must be annoyed with someone who is just taking photos
of them fighting.
Anyway I think that journalists make changes with their job as they let
people know what's really going on around the world.
Catherine said…
I think that this photo is dramatic, but we don't know the whole situation. Photographers of such events have an awful job. They can't help everybody, they see this cruelty everyday and they can't do anything about it, on the other hand they want to show how it really looks like, to people who aren't there, so that they (governments, armies) could do something. Sometimes only thing that works is shock. Mayby that was the purpose of this photo? Or mayby it was only for money and so called fame? I can't tell, and probably nobody can.
Ola Piotrowska said…
We don’t know all aspects of situations shown on this photo and all motivations of those photographers. I want to believe, and I believe that they wanted to show this cruelty and suffering, to motivate organisation and normal people from west civilization to more effective actions against wars and starvation, not to have a bigger salary or fame.
Unknown said…
I don't believe somebody can discuss moral aspect of Carter's photography, especially after his statement of waiting for vulture's wingspread... that's terrible and just plain wrong. Photographing a war can be useful sometimes, because it can help people in visualizing horrors of a conflict. But refusing to help people just to get better shot... it shouldn't be awarded, it should be punished instead.
Unknown said…
I don't think that reportes or photographers should help people or animals when they are doing their jobs. They shouldn't intervene into others life. They have to report things like they really are, there are a lot of charity organisations that take care of poor people in Africa. Those organisations actually help and they wouldn't have so many followers if nobody could do a good report about how devastated those counties are.
Wdowiak Natalia said…
I think that journalist may cause some changes - they make people around world able to see terryfying things which are happening every day miles from them, and that is first step to make changes.
Unknown said…
I think it's more about the art, or bringing light to a situation, than the money. Being a war photographer is dangerous and heart-breaking, and I think something else than money must motivate these people. Whether it is from a perverted sentimentality, or some twisted empathy, I don't know if I can truly understand these people. Situations like these bring up several questions- about the importance of art, the dedication of artists, whether help is required from a human or if it is simply goodwill. It's very difficult to give a definite answer.
Of course they can, that's why several genres of books and newspaper exist. I don't think many people normally get a lot of pleasure from reading about genocide or the darker aspects of the human mind, but it's important to know about and explore these places on a moral level. I think we can learn a lot about ourselves simply in the ways we react to such situations, and that is always valuable.
Unknown said…
War photographers are really brave. They bring this terrible reality to people. Most of such photos are peaces of art and it realy inspires and makes us thinking about it, feeling it and sometimes even crying or smiling.
Sure journalists can affect people minds. They bring us information, isn't it importent? Some people say that journalists are the 4th government and it's true. They can change man's opinion in one phrase, so photo or book can change opinion of hunderts, millions people.
Justyna Gryz said…
I have never heard of war photographers. They give us an idea of how the war. We can imagine the enormity of the disaster. However, it's a little controversial, that in the face of such things these people simply take pictures. Undoubtedly, such people are also potrrzebni, although little is shocking that they can remain passive in the face of injustice. I think also that they create look at some of the issues and realize the people, so they are doing a good job. In addition, this work is not easy and certainly has a big wpłych psyche, and this in turn can lead to depression, nervous breakdown or stimulants.
Unknown said…
I know it's really hard to watch on this kind of photo but in fact we need to think about the job of war journalist. They want to show us the worst face of war, to play on our emotions and in fact - they managed to. They also pay big price for their job - so as Carter.
We don't know what wewould do on their place. I can't imagine me being in heart of war, but I have been thinking about helping international humanitarian organizations lots of times!
I still appreciate what they do, even their photos are poorly received.
Unknown said…
Morality of war photographers is tough issue. There is always question: why they do photos instead of helping those people? But if they only help there would be no records of history. Without those photos and films we wouldn’t know what happen and is happening. Falsifying history would be easier.
I think journalists can make changes with their photos and books. They can introduce problems average people don’t see and because of their fame or authority create awareness and make people want to change something in their life and whole world. They can protest against something, they can sign petitions, they can boycott companies or government. People are strong and can make a difference, We need to remember about this.
Unknown said…
I think that war photographers have a very difficult but extremely important role to fulfill. Thanks to them, people can see with their own eyes how war is a story. However, their work is dangerous, after all they are in the place where the war is going on, they are just as exposed as other people staying there. The experience of war may also have a bad influence on their psyche, tragic images that they must grasp with their apartment are forever in their memory and leaving a 'scar'. Further problems provide them with moral dilemmas, whether to first take a picture or help the victim.
However, I think that by taking a moving photo, they are able to transform the hearts of many people and thus do a lot of good things. In the psyche of people, the photo is memorable and moves so that we want to change the world for the better. Thanks to the photo of Kevin Carter, many people began to help the victims in the war.
Unknown said…
Honestly, I can’t imagine this situation. Taking this photo must have been a terrible experience. Many people in the comments suspect that the photographer didn’t help this child just to have a good photo. I don’t believe that it really was. I trust people and their good intentions. I hope that he just wanted to show the difficult situation in that country. In my opinion being war photographer must be really hard and dangerous job, so I'm not sure if the money can make up for it.
Unknown said…
There are jobs that have a special mission, like journalist, writers or photographers. Their task is to give people information about events, wars, catastrophes, cataclysms and other things which are similar. When we talk about wars and dramatic events, it is important to don’t let people forget about this situations. I don’t know if there is such a thing as morality when we talk about war or hunger that kills war victims. One photographer can’t help all the victims. His task is to commemorate this incident, as a warning to other people. As it was with a photo mentioned in presentation, thanks to the man who took it, the theme of the war victims in Sudan was publicized. People wanted to know what happened to the child. Thanks to this, many of them offered help for the victims. Kevin Carter fulfilled his mission and paid a very high price for it.
Unknown said…
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Unknown said…
Honestly, I have mixed feelings after reading this. I can't imagine such a situation and not to help. I don't really know on photography but I think none of photo is worth it. On the other hand, photographers have some kind of mission. They are focus on realizing people cruelty of war.
Unknown said…
I am a pacifist and I believe that a war is the worst thing that can happen to people. Due to this fact, I believe that journalists and war photographers have a really important mission - show cruelty and stupidity of a war, e. g. when they show ruined cities, killed people or hungry children. Of course, their activity result in a lot of moral problems. When they want to make super photo, they cross thin borders. However, it is their job. I would be glad if people stop making wars and their reasons (nationalism, fascism, xenophobia and patriarchy) due to the photographs of places of the Earth when evil forces win.
Klaudia said…
I really don't know, what to think about it. At first I thought about their motives - why they're doing such photos? Is their only reveille money and greed for fame? Or maybe they doing it to make the world find out how war really looks like? I think that motives can determine whether they are good or bad people. It must be hard for them to watch people dying and personally I don't think I would be able to take photo of someone who is sufferying. War journalists' work may be needed, if it's not about gaining profit, but when it spread help and knowledge about people tragedies. I'm sure that photo took by Kevin Carter induce lots of people to help, think about how bad world can be and how much we should appreciate our life.
Kasia Kasia said…
This comment has been removed by the author.
Kasia Kasia said…
The situation is very confusing. I've got plenty of questions in my head after reading the presentation. Maybe I should reach for the book to look for the answers. Why didn't Carter help the girl immediately after taking this bitter photo? He was doing his job- it's obvious. But I thought it would be an automatic manoeuvre in such a situation to take care of a starving powerless child. But it's a war journalist's job to show the cruel. However, if such photos didn't exist, people wouldn't know how awful war can be. I think Carter's aim was to rouse people to action against war. Unfortunately, it was used to destroy him mentally. This is a very popular picture but I didn't know that such a story hides behind it. It's very difficult to determine its legitimacy. I think Carter is not to blame but the war is.
I really admire press photographer and their work. I am sensible of hardship which they must endure during war. I am grateful that I can reflect upon my own problems and spot that in effect I don't have true problems. Really huge trial is discord on the Earth. Due to it is relevant to display fallout which bring every war. Maybe then people will appreciate value of peace.
In my opinion war photographers have a strong ethical sense and a lot of courage to face the reality of war. Their ethical behaviour is usually affected by their personal prejudice. Some of them might think that they are unable to change the faith of individuals and after some time they become indifferent towards the suffering people and unaffected by the images while many of them cannot stand seeing those kind of views and photographing them. From my point of view morality of war photographers depends on their personality and their attitude towards the job their perform. I don't think that they can change a lot when it comes to the cruelty of war but they are important as they can make people aware of what is going on in the world and give them the possibility to face the reality some people are forced to live in.
Lena Sobalak said…
I had that topic on my polish lessons in secondary school. I do not really understand HOW photographers can do such "amazing" photos during such tragic events. I am not sure what these people think, maybe they are egoistic and think only about the money? I do not know. Maybe they have a little war inside of their brains. They are thinking about helping kids and other people whom we can see on their works. It is a really interesting topic. I believe that every human being is different, so we should not make an assessment after one talk or thought.
Ewa Chojnacka said…
This is the main dilemma of photojournalism and we need to understand both point of views. We have to ask the question, what is important helping other people directly or give other help by touting the problem for whole of the world. It is not only the job, this is a misision which can be damegful for mental health of these people. This is the most important part of journalistic ethics issue and as long as media exists we are still going to consider which point of view is more important for us.

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